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Cost per milligram, computed honestly across formats — the long version

BA
b.aaltoTL2 Moderator29 Jan 2025#1

Cost per milligram, computed honestly across formats — the long version Writing it up because I had to work it out twice and would rather nobody else did.

A coverage question with the paperwork detail included, since that is what determines the answer.

Denial received, with a stated reason. My reading of the reason is that it tells me exactly what to submit next, which is the useful thing about a well-written denial.

Before I spend a week on it: is my reading of the stated criterion correct, and is there a documented precedent for this specific ground?

2 likes 18mo
BI
blank_injectionTL2Analytical chemist1 Feb 2025#2

Compute cost per delivered dose at your dose if you want a number you can act on. That requires knowing your dose, vial volume, and whether you are using a vial or a pen.

0 likes 18mo
SA
s.antonsenTL2 Moderator3 Feb 2025#3

Coming back to the opening post, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Discount programmes and coupons: manufacturers often offer coupons that reduce out-of-pocket costs if insurance is not covering or is covering at a high copay. These have eligibility restrictions but can save money.

16 likes 18mo
FP
forest_plotTL3Evidence synthesis5 Feb 2025#4

Picking up post #3: that is the part I would want checked first.

For anyone arriving from a search: the marked solution above is the direct answer, and the replies underneath it add the caveats that make it safe to use.

6 likes 18mo
CO
c.ostergaardTL2 Moderator7 Feb 2025#5
forest_plot, post #4: Picking up post #3: that is the part I would want checked first. For anyone arriving from a search: the marked solution above is the direct answer, and the replies underneath it add the caveats that make it safe to use. Go to post

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

3 likes in reply to #4 18mo
HS
hana.satoTL4 Moderator9 Feb 2025#6
forest_plot, post #4: Picking up post #3: that is the part I would want checked first. For anyone arriving from a search: the marked solution above is the direct answer, and the replies underneath it add the caveats that make it safe to use. Go to post
Staff post. Actions described here are recorded in the public moderation log and may be challenged in Meta.

Price variation between pharmacies: identical prescriptions can cost different amounts at different pharmacies because pharmacies negotiate individually with insurers and manufacturers.

0 likes in reply to #4 18mo
HB
h.bakkerTL2 Moderator10 Feb 2025 · edited#7

I read post #5 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Subscription services and subscriptions: some online clinics bundle compounds into subscription models with different pricing. Understanding the terms before committing matters.

23 likes 18mo
MS
m.strand_rphTL3Pharmacist12 Feb 2025#8

Biosimilars and future generics: as patents expire, biosimilar and generic versions might become available and prices might fall. That has already happened for some proteins; incretin agonist pricing might follow.

10 likes 17mo
AK
a.kowalskiTL2 Moderator13 Feb 2025#9

International pricing: the same compound costs very different amounts in different countries because healthcare systems and regulatory frameworks differ. Generally, US prices are higher than other developed nations.

22 likes 17mo
TW
t.wojcikTL2 Moderator15 Feb 2025#10

post #9 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

Pharmacy acquisition cost: a pharmacy pays less than the patient pays, even at insurance rates. That margin is where the pharmacy's costs and profit live.

10 likes 17mo
JF
j.fonsecaTL2 Moderator16 Feb 2025#11

post #10 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit.

Insurance tier placement: a compound might be covered but on a higher tier (higher copay). Moving to a lower tier usually requires prior authorization or documented failure of cheaper alternatives.

0 likes 17mo
PW
PharmNotes_WhitfieldTL4Pharmacist17 Feb 2025#12
j.fonseca, post #11: post #10 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit. Insurance tier placement: a compound might be covered but on a higher tier (higher copay). Moving to a lower tier usually requires prior authorization or documented failure of cheaper alternatives. Go to post

Worth separating two things that post #8 runs together.

Cost per milligram is the only comparison that survives format differences, but even then it needs care. A pen and a vial are not the same product and cannot be compared on price per milligram alone because dead volume, wastage, and number of doses actually obtainable differ.

1 like in reply to #11 17mo
NB
n.brobergTL2 Moderator19 Feb 2025 · edited#13

Compute cost per delivered dose at your dose if you want a number you can act on. That requires knowing your dose, vial volume, and whether you are using a vial or a pen.

11 likes 17mo
OO
orbitrap_olaTL3Mass spectrometrist20 Feb 2025#14

List prices versus negotiated prices: the price a pharmaceutical company publishes and the price an insurance company or pharmacy actually pays differ substantially. List price is not what anyone pays.

24 likes 17mo
ML
m.lehtinenTL2 Moderator21 Feb 2025#15
a.kowalski, post #9: International pricing: the same compound costs very different amounts in different countries because healthcare systems and regulatory frameworks differ. Generally, US prices are higher than other developed nations. Go to post

Biosimilars and future generics: as patents expire, biosimilar and generic versions might become available and prices might fall. That has already happened for some proteins; incretin agonist pricing might follow.

0 likes in reply to #9 17mo
CC
c.cardosoTL2 Moderator22 Feb 2025#16
n.broberg, post #13: Compute cost per delivered dose at your dose if you want a number you can act on. That requires knowing your dose, vial volume, and whether you are using a vial or a pen. Go to post

On post #12 — agreed on the reasoning, with one qualification.

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

3 likes in reply to #13 17mo
FS
f.sjobergTL2 Moderator24 Feb 2025#17

Price variation between pharmacies: identical prescriptions can cost different amounts at different pharmacies because pharmacies negotiate individually with insurers and manufacturers.

16 likes 17mo
DO
dr_okonkwoTL4 Moderator25 Feb 2025#18

International pricing: the same compound costs very different amounts in different countries because healthcare systems and regulatory frameworks differ. Generally, US prices are higher than other developed nations.

32 likes 17mo
FW
f.weissTL2 Moderator26 Feb 2025#19
a.kowalski, post #9: International pricing: the same compound costs very different amounts in different countries because healthcare systems and regulatory frameworks differ. Generally, US prices are higher than other developed nations. Go to post

Thank you for the correction. I have edited my earlier post with a note rather than silently, so the thread still makes sense to read. The error was mine and it was the kind that comes from remembering a figure instead of looking it up.

25 likes in reply to #9 17mo
WN
w.novakTL3Regular27 Feb 2025#20

Subscription services and subscriptions: some online clinics bundle compounds into subscription models with different pricing. Understanding the terms before committing matters.

0 likes 17mo
IA
id.almeidaTL2 Moderator1 Mar 2025#21
w.novak, post #20: Subscription services and subscriptions: some online clinics bundle compounds into subscription models with different pricing. Understanding the terms before committing matters. Go to post

Pharmacy acquisition cost: a pharmacy pays less than the patient pays, even at insurance rates. That margin is where the pharmacy's costs and profit live.

2 likes in reply to #20 17mo
BD
baseline_driftTL2Analytical chemist2 Mar 2025#22

Discount programmes and coupons: manufacturers often offer coupons that reduce out-of-pocket costs if insurance is not covering or is covering at a high copay. These have eligibility restrictions but can save money.

0 likes 17mo
JI
j.iyerTL2 Moderator3 Mar 2025#23

Coming back to post #21, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Having read the exchange above, I think I was wrong earlier in this topic and I want to say so plainly rather than quietly editing.

The correction was fair and I had been repeating something I had not checked carefully enough.

27 likes 17mo
BV
bias_varianceTL4Biostatistician4 Mar 2025#24
hana.sato, post #6: Price variation between pharmacies: identical prescriptions can cost different amounts at different pharmacies because pharmacies negotiate individually with insurers and manufacturers. Go to post

Picking up post #21: that is the part I would want checked first.

Insurance tier placement: a compound might be covered but on a higher tier (higher copay). Moving to a lower tier usually requires prior authorization or documented failure of cheaper alternatives.

13 likes in reply to #6 17mo
CT
c.tullochTL2 Moderator5 Mar 2025#25
s.antonsen, post #3: Coming back to the opening post, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer. Discount programmes and coupons: manufacturers often offer coupons that reduce out-of-pocket costs if insurance is not covering or is covering at a high copay. These have eligibility restrictions but can save money. Go to post

Cost per milligram is the only comparison that survives format differences, but even then it needs care. A pen and a vial are not the same product and cannot be compared on price per milligram alone because dead volume, wastage, and number of doses actually obtainable differ.

4 likes in reply to #3 17mo
K
KLindqvistTL4 Moderator6 Mar 2025#26
Staff post. Actions described here are recorded in the public moderation log and may be challenged in Meta.

post #25 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit.

Price variation between pharmacies: identical prescriptions can cost different amounts at different pharmacies because pharmacies negotiate individually with insurers and manufacturers.

0 likes 17mo
NK
n.krastevTL2 Moderator7 Mar 2025#27

I read post #25 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Discount programmes and coupons: manufacturers often offer coupons that reduce out-of-pocket costs if insurance is not covering or is covering at a high copay. These have eligibility restrictions but can save money.

0 likes 17mo
DO
d.oyelaranTL3Pharmacist8 Mar 2025#28

Thank you for the correction. I have edited my earlier post with a note rather than silently, so the thread still makes sense to read. The error was mine and it was the kind that comes from remembering a figure instead of looking it up.

19 likes 17mo
VN
v.nascimentoTL2 Moderator10 Mar 2025 · edited#29

On post #25 — agreed on the reasoning, with one qualification.

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

8 likes 17mo
NR
n.rahimiTL2 Moderator11 Mar 2025#30

Insurance tier placement: a compound might be covered but on a higher tier (higher copay). Moving to a lower tier usually requires prior authorization or documented failure of cheaper alternatives.

2 likes 17mo