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Analytics · Mass spectrometry · continued

Charge states for a 4 kDa peptide, worked through posts 31–60

This is a continuation of a long topic, addressed by post number rather than by page. Start at post 1 · go to the accepted answer.

AP
ar.petrovTL2 Moderator6 Mar 2025 · edited#31
d.nilsen, post #10: What mass accuracy establishes: the measured mass is consistent with a specific composition. What it does not establish: purity, sequence order, stereochemistry, or the absence of an isobaric species. Every one of those requires something else. Go to post

Coming back to post #29, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Electrospray ionisation produces multiply charged ions. For a 4 kDa peptide you expect mostly 2+, 3+, and 4+ charge states. Reading an electrospray spectrum means recognizing the envelope, not looking for one peak.

6 likes in reply to #10 17mo
K
KForsbergTL2Member6 Mar 2025#32

Picking up post #29: that is the part I would want checked first.

Purity and identity are different questions: LC-MS establishes that the species at a retention time has the expected mass. It does not establish how much of the sample is that species (that is what LC-UV purity answers).

1 like 17mo
SH
s.hartmannTL2 Moderator6 Mar 2025#33

Sample matrix effects: if a sample is dissolved in a complex matrix, other compounds in the matrix can suppress the peptide signal. Clean samples give higher sensitivity than dirty samples.

0 likes 17mo
DI
diluent_indexTL1Member6 Mar 2025#34

Quantitation by MS: most quantitation is done by LC-UV detection at 214 nm, not by MS, because extinction coefficients are better known. MS can quantify if an internal standard is used but that requires preparation.

23 likes 17mo
ON
o.nybergTL2 Moderator6 Mar 2025#35
am.wikstrom, post #15: What mass accuracy establishes: the measured mass is consistent with a specific composition. What it does not establish: purity, sequence order, stereochemistry, or the absence of an isobaric species. Every one of those requires something else. Go to post

I read post #33 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Desalting before analysis: some samples need desalting to remove salts that suppress the peptide signal. Report whether desalting was used, because it can affect the apparent ionization efficiency and the reported purity.

3 likes in reply to #15 17mo
M
MakinenTL2Member6 Mar 2025#36

Tandem mass spectrometry: MS/MS fragments the molecular ion and uses fragment masses to confirm identity and detect modifications. A simple identity confirmation by LC-MS does not address post-translational modifications or impurities with the same or very close mass.

0 likes 17mo
ZV
z.vogelTL2 Moderator6 Mar 2025#37

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

32 likes 17mo
W
WoodhouseTL2Member6 Mar 2025#38
j.restrepo, post #28: Purity and identity are different questions: LC-MS establishes that the species at a retention time has the expected mass. It does not establish how much of the sample is that species (that is what LC-UV purity answers). Go to post

post #37 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit.

Calibration matters: a high-resolution instrument out of calibration can report mass with ppm error large enough to be uninformative. Check when the instrument was last calibrated before trusting the reported accuracy.

16 likes in reply to #28 17mo
FE
f.espinozaTL2 Moderator7 Mar 2025#39

Common adducts: sodium adds ≈22, potassium adds ≈38 compared to hydrogen. A [M+Na]+ peak is common and its mass is predictable from the base mass.

15 likes 17mo
GF
gradient_fileTL2Member7 Mar 2025#40

Charge states observed: for semaglutide (4113.6 Da) the doubly charged ion appears at m/z ≈ 2057, triply charged at ≈ 1371, quadruply at ≈ 1029. Those are the positions to look for; the heights depend on the ionization efficiency.

6 likes 17mo
JC
j.cabreraTL2 Moderator7 Mar 2025#41
a.coelho, post #17: Common adducts: sodium adds ≈22, potassium adds ≈38 compared to hydrogen. A [M+Na]+ peak is common and its mass is predictable from the base mass. Go to post

Mass accuracy is expressed in parts per million. It is the difference between observed and theoretical mass divided by theoretical mass, multiplied by a million. A high-resolution instrument in good calibration achieves low single-digit ppm on a peptide of this size.

3 likes in reply to #17 17mo
TS
taper_shiftTL3Regular7 Mar 2025#42
se.okafor, post #26: On post #22 — agreed on the reasoning, with one qualification. Sample matrix effects: if a sample is dissolved in a complex matrix, other compounds in the matrix can suppress the peptide signal. Clean samples give higher sensitivity than dirty samples. Go to post

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

10 likes in reply to #26 17mo
VO
v.okonkwoTL2 Moderator7 Mar 2025#43

What mass accuracy establishes: the measured mass is consistent with a specific composition. What it does not establish: purity, sequence order, stereochemistry, or the absence of an isobaric species. Every one of those requires something else.

30 likes 17mo
F
FFaulknerTL3Regular7 Mar 2025#44

Worth separating two things that post #40 runs together.

Resolution: "high resolution" commonly means <5 ppm across the mass range. Unit-resolution instruments achieve ±1 Da at best and cannot distinguish two species differing by less than 1 Da in total mass.

0 likes 17mo
BA
b.adeyemiTL2 Moderator7 Mar 2025 · edited#45
j.delacroix, post #14: Picking up post #11: that is the part I would want checked first. Common adducts: sodium adds ≈22, potassium adds ≈38 compared to hydrogen. A [M+Na]+ peak is common and its mass is predictable from the base mass. Go to post

Picking up post #42: that is the part I would want checked first.

For anyone arriving from a search: the marked solution above is the direct answer, and the replies underneath it add the caveats that make it safe to use.

5 likes in reply to #14 17mo
O
OFalkenbergTL1Member8 Mar 2025#46
p.fontaine, post #24: Desalting before analysis: some samples need desalting to remove salts that suppress the peptide signal. Report whether desalting was used, because it can affect the apparent ionization efficiency and the reported purity. Go to post

Common adducts: sodium adds ≈22, potassium adds ≈38 compared to hydrogen. A [M+Na]+ peak is common and its mass is predictable from the base mass.

15 likes in reply to #24 17mo
IB
i.beaulieuTL2 Moderator8 Mar 2025#47

Mass accuracy is expressed in parts per million. It is the difference between observed and theoretical mass divided by theoretical mass, multiplied by a million. A high-resolution instrument in good calibration achieves low single-digit ppm on a peptide of this size.

0 likes 17mo
I
IMainwaringTL3Regular8 Mar 2025#48

What mass accuracy establishes: the measured mass is consistent with a specific composition. What it does not establish: purity, sequence order, stereochemistry, or the absence of an isobaric species. Every one of those requires something else.

1 like 17mo
AA
a.asanteTL2 Moderator8 Mar 2025#49

Charge states observed: for semaglutide (4113.6 Da) the doubly charged ion appears at m/z ≈ 2057, triply charged at ≈ 1371, quadruply at ≈ 1029. Those are the positions to look for; the heights depend on the ionization efficiency.

9 likes 17mo
LP
l.piresTL2 Moderator8 Mar 2025#50
taper_shift, post #42: Two things before anyone answers the substance. First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound. Go to post

I read post #48 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Calibration matters: a high-resolution instrument out of calibration can report mass with ppm error large enough to be uninformative. Check when the instrument was last calibrated before trusting the reported accuracy.

21 likes in reply to #42 17mo
HS
hana.satoTL4 Moderator8 Mar 2025#51
Staff post. Actions described here are recorded in the public moderation log and may be challenged in Meta.

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

3 likes 17mo
AA
a.aguirreTL2 Moderator8 Mar 2025#52
Makinen, post #36: Tandem mass spectrometry: MS/MS fragments the molecular ion and uses fragment masses to confirm identity and detect modifications. A simple identity confirmation by LC-MS does not address post-translational modifications or impurities with the same or very close mass. Go to post

Resolution: "high resolution" commonly means <5 ppm across the mass range. Unit-resolution instruments achieve ±1 Da at best and cannot distinguish two species differing by less than 1 Da in total mass.

0 likes in reply to #36 17mo
PI
p.iyer_pharmdTL3Pharmacist8 Mar 2025#53
c.correia, post #20: post #19 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different. Mass accuracy is expressed in parts per million. It is the difference between observed and theoretical mass divided by theoretical mass, multiplied by a million. A high-resolution instrument in good calibration achieves low single-digit ppm on a peptide of… Go to post

I read post #51 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Desalting before analysis: some samples need desalting to remove salts that suppress the peptide signal. Report whether desalting was used, because it can affect the apparent ionization efficiency and the reported purity.

24 likes in reply to #20 17mo
JA
j.asanteTL2 Moderator8 Mar 2025 · edited#54

This follows post #51 rather than contradicting it.

Tandem mass spectrometry: MS/MS fragments the molecular ion and uses fragment masses to confirm identity and detect modifications. A simple identity confirmation by LC-MS does not address post-translational modifications or impurities with the same or very close mass.

11 likes 17mo
SS
system_suitabilityTL3Analytical chemist9 Mar 2025#55

Quantitation by MS: most quantitation is done by LC-UV detection at 214 nm, not by MS, because extinction coefficients are better known. MS can quantify if an internal standard is used but that requires preparation.

1 like 17mo
ZO
z.okonkwoTL2 Moderator9 Mar 2025#56

post #55 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

I disagree with the reply above, and I think the disagreement is substantive rather than terminological.

The distinction being drawn does not survive when you look at the published data for this specific question. I would be glad to be shown wrong on this, because the version I am arguing against is more convenient.

0 likes 17mo
KO
k.otieno_statsTL39 Mar 2025#57
NI
n.ibarraTL2 Moderator9 Mar 2025#58

Purity and identity are different questions: LC-MS establishes that the species at a retention time has the expected mass. It does not establish how much of the sample is that species (that is what LC-UV purity answers).

7 likes 17mo
NV
n.vogelTL2 Moderator9 Mar 2025 · edited#59
r.mensah, post #8: Desalting before analysis: some samples need desalting to remove salts that suppress the peptide signal. Report whether desalting was used, because it can affect the apparent ionization efficiency and the reported purity. Go to post

Worth separating two things that post #55 runs together.

Electrospray ionisation produces multiply charged ions. For a 4 kDa peptide you expect mostly 2+, 3+, and 4+ charge states. Reading an electrospray spectrum means recognizing the envelope, not looking for one peak.

0 likes in reply to #8 17mo
OC
o.cousineauTL3Regular9 Mar 2025#60
j.asante, post #54: This follows post #51 rather than contradicting it. Tandem mass spectrometry: MS/MS fragments the molecular ion and uses fragment masses to confirm identity and detect modifications. A simple identity confirmation by LC-MS does not address post-translational modifications or impurities with the same or very close mass. Go to post

Quantitation by MS: most quantitation is done by LC-UV detection at 214 nm, not by MS, because extinction coefficients are better known. MS can quantify if an internal standard is used but that requires preparation.

0 likes in reply to #54 17mo